Is the Republican Party the Only Choice for Christians?

by Pattie Hughes | More from this Blogger

31 Oct 2008 09:57 AM

Good Christians should vote Republican. You hear this statement all the time from Christian people when asked why they voted for the president and other Republican candidates. We've seen it from time to time in our own forums. The Republican Party has done a great job of convincing otherwise intelligent people that they will burn in Hell, if they vote for Democrats. Just listen to the recent rhetoric from Sarah Palin in a recent interview with James Dobson for Focus on the Family. She said, "God would do the right thing on Election Day."

They have equated being a good Christian with being a Republican. In the documentary With God on Our Side: George W Bush and the Rise of the Religious Right in America, the evolution of this belief can be seen. Then they attempted to use the same tactics to court married couples by equating marriage and children with the same idea. In the documentary, David Frum, a former White House speech writer, articulated this belief. He said, "Are you married and do you have children? If you are, you're probably a Republican. If you don't, you're probably not."

As a married woman with children who attends Mass every Sunday, I was offended. I consider myself a liberal as well as a person of faith. Yes, we do exist. And in surprisingly larger numbers than some Republicans realize. According to most polls, nearly 90% of Americans believe in God and since about half the people voted Democrat in the last few elections, it can be assumed that not all people who believe in God vote Republican. The Democratic leadership must stop allowing the party to be cast as the evil, godless, hell bound party.

They are not only hijacking our election process and constitution, but God as well. To use God as a political tool is disgusting. These are not men of faith or followers of Jesus. They are hypocrites of the worst kind. They have people of faith fooled into believing they are one of them. They are not. Jesus was very clear about what he wanted us to do with our time on earth. More than anything else, Jesus commanded his followers to take care of each other. A consistent theme of caring for the poor and those unable to care for themselves can be seen in the words of Jesus.

Excess, greed, lying and selfishness existed in the officials of His time as well. Jesus stood in the temple calling them hypocrites. Abuse of power was rampant. Jesus didn't remain quiet. He denounced tax collectors because they abused their authority at the expense of the common man. His criticisms of the religious and governmental leaders of the time are what ultimately lead to his crucifixion.

At the most basic level, to be a Christian means to be a follower of Christ and to aspire to live your life according to His teachings. If Jesus were president of the United States, what would He be doing? Would He be cutting the budget and taking heating oil away from the low income elderly, while dumping buckets of money into Iraq? Would He vote against extending health care benefits to children of the working poor, as John McCain did? Certainly not. Would He be waging war and causing untold death, pain and suffering? Would He be cutting taxes for the very wealthy, while ignoring our schools and the poor? Jesus was a progressive. He challenged those in power. His message is one of compassion and caring for those less fortunate.

To reach out to people of faith, this is what Democrats should be talking about. The Republicans have done a great job in making many religious people feel they have to side with them, and they use the pro life issue for leverage. Democrats need to show that their overall social agenda most mirrors the values held by most mainstream Christians and those expressed by Jesus during his time on Earth.

Jesus told us what we need to do to be his followers. Jesus said to Peter "feed my sheep." How is this interpreted as cutting money used in food pantry programs? The food pantry programs at my own church and others around the country are struggling to feed the needy since they are now getting less funding and the current economic crisis has left a larger number of hungry families in need of help. Republican talking points ignore the true message of Jesus and focus on issues that inflame and divide. Never once in Jesus' ministry did he speak of homosexuality. Yet, squashing the rights of gay couples has become a huge crusade in this administration and many in the Republican Party. This plays on fears and prejudice.

The abortion issue is held up as evidence of the evil of the Democratic candidates and a mandate for good Christians to vote against them. This is one thing the Democrats can't avoid. Most people of faith aren't crazy about abortion. They have been brainwashed into the Republican Party to vote solely on this issue. They must stand by the Republicans because they are Pro Life. O.K., so if this is true then there must be fewer abortions when Republicans are in office. Right? Wrong.

Eight years with Reagan, four with George HW, and five with George W, and no real changes. According to statistics from the Centers for Disease control, abortions dramatically decreased during the Clinton Administration. Yes, Clinton who is portrayed as evil incarnate by the Republican Party. The last year of George H.W.'s administration, 1,359,146 abortions were reported to the CDC. That number dropped every year of Clinton's presidency. By the time he left office, the number was 857,475. That's right; abortions were nearly cut in half during Clinton's presidency.

This information wasn't difficult to find; it's available on the CDC's website. Why haven't I hear this during recent campaigns? The Democrats really need to wake up and fight back against this smear campaign by the Republican Party. An interesting side note, the highest abortion numbers in the last years of Clinton's administration were reported in Florida and Texas, where the Bush Brothers were Governor.

Why did this happen? To repeat an often used phrase, it's the economy, stupid. The economy improved dramatically over the course of Clinton's presidency. Consider this possibility: Woman #1 has discovered she is pregnant. She and her boyfriend/husband both have good jobs and adequate health insurance. The economy is strong and their jobs are secure. Woman #2 just found out her boyfriend/husband is getting laid off due to closing/downsizing/factory moving to Mexico. The economy is bad and the company has to consolidate or close. She has health insurance through his job, but can't afford to pay the premium once he's laid off. The economy is bad and the job market tight. He hasn't found a new job yet. Which woman will have her baby and which will feel she has no choice but to seek an abortion?

Too many liberals are responding with a knee jerk reaction. We don't have to be opposite on every issue. Most Democrats believe in God. Being a Democrat doesn't mean you are evil. This idea is the result of Republican brainwashing with a twisted view of God and religion. Democrats need to show people of faith that their party is the one who most reflects the values of Jesus. The Democratic party is the one that takes care of those in need and works to help working families and support education. These are the things I want to hear from our candidates. The Democrats have been spineless in the last few election cycles and have allowed the Party to be painted as unholy and evil. Democrats need to fight back against the idea that to believe in God means you are required to vote for Republicans, and they need to start now.

 
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Learn more about Pattie Hughes
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Pattie Hughes is a freelance writer and mother of four young children. She and her husband have been married since 1992. Pattie holds a degree in Elementary Education from Florida Atlantic University.

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User Comments

ruthann8 (6378) 31 Oct 2008 10:33 AM

Last night after a discussion with friends/coworkers I was questioning myself. Am I making the right decision? They were going on and on about what the bible said and then someone said "we can't really discuss this with someone who doesn't really understand" It made me feel stupid. Well this morning I spent searching the internet for my own answers on non-biased sites. I even thought about changing my mind. I have really got to learn to stick up for my beliefs. Thank you for this blog, I needed a little boost today.

Memartha Online! (301) 31 Oct 2008 02:47 PM

You go, Patty! God is not a Republican... or a Democrat!

Valorie Delp (49340) 31 Oct 2008 07:16 PM

YIKES! Is this personal because people have attacked you or is this intelligent rhetoric? I frankly, cannot tell and it's disappointing. I generally admire you for your convictions and your intelligent thought in policital processes. . .despite the fact that I stand on the opposite side of the fence on almost every issue. Not ONCE have I accused you of being non-Christian or lacking in faith--and yet that is what you are doing here to me and those who think like me, when you imply that God wouldn't vote like John McCain. If you really want to play the God card, I don't think he'd vote like Obama either. . .or Palin. . .or anyone else that's been in office for that matter. Furthermore, you also imply that we are stupid--choosing to believe whatever we happen to hear from whatever source we happen to hear it. I take it you assume that those who are voting for McCain are just plain ignorant and stupid. Offensive--truly offensive--because rhetoric like this shuts down conversations rather than promoting them.

Pattie Hughes (7652) 31 Oct 2008 07:57 PM

Wow, this wasn't personal and actually I've had these thoughts based on conversations for years. The Republican Party has been playing the God Card for the last several election cycles. It's more than disappointing; it's offensive to those of us who believe in God, yet hear frequently from politicians, family members, friends, pastors and strangers that they are wrong and it's immoral to vote for the Democrat. It is a political ploy used by some politicians to get votes. Ruthann has obviously been hearing it too.

I don't imply that voting for McCain makes anyone stupid. The idea that if someone is Christian they have to vote in any way, either right or left is stupid. We each take our personal values and how we interpret our beliefs into consideration when voting. Personally, I firmly agree with the separation of church and state, as intended by our founders. I think God should be kept out of politics, but sadly, he is not. God is reduced to a slogan when politicians go on television and say "God is on our side" or "God will do the right thing on Election Day." That implies that God will make sure people vote for them, because they somehow have the patent on God in politics. It is offensive and I certainly didn't start that conversation. Rove really kicked it into high gear, but it was rearing its ugly head even before him.

I never said, or thought, that you had implied anything at all about me and this blog was in no way directed at you. Two things that made me actually publish the thoughts were actually politicians. The first was Sarah Palin's comments to Dobson and the other was Elizabeth Dole's disgusting campaign smear of calling her opponent "godless" in a campaign ad. This really has to stop, but again, it has nothing to do with you at all. I apologize if you took it as any kind of attack. It isn't. It's just an opposing point of view.

mcmama (51978) 31 Oct 2008 09:23 PM

My oldest son is one of those liberal Christians. He gets a bit weary of non Christians generalizing us all as evangelical and right wing. He got a taste of the anti Christian bias in this culture in his first year in college, and it was really a challenge. No one wanted to really share or learn. Just blame Christians for everything. After all, we're all minions of George Bush.

A lot of left wing arguments have to do with the values of a secular society. That's the stereotype - left is reason, argument, logic, idealism - no spirituality - and right is all about God and family and guns. That's the way the spin doctors twirl us around. And this election is changing that. The old images no longer apply, so let's reinvent the candidates in smear campaigns, and distort the image.

We are really talking about race and religion this time. Really. And it is about time. Not just some soundbite, not just some platitude. Really talking. Really sharing our thoughts, our perceptions, our fears. And the spin doctors can't cure it. Thanks for bringing this up, Pattie

Valorie Delp (49340) 01 Nov 2008 02:18 AM

Pattie I know the blog wasn't directed at me personally. And yes, the Republican party appeals to their strong base--which happen to be conservative Christians--and yes, it can be shameless. I didn't hear Sarah Palin's remarks to Dobson, but she is talking to conservative Christians who think that sending a liberal to the Supreme Court is bad. I just want you to know that there are those of us who are conservative, right wing, and go beyond the God card and we can think and research beyond the mudslinging--that comes from both sides. There is nothing that is above reproach in this or any other election and while the Republicans use 'God' tactics, the Democrats have their own tactics as well. It was not what you said, but how you said it that I found so offensive. You know I have no problem agreeing to disagree. . .but don't tell me that God would not have voted like McCain.

mcmama (51978) 01 Nov 2008 05:00 AM

Very true about wwjd when it comes to voting. I left a liberal church because I got tired of hearing about how God agrees with us and Jesus would do it our way and only our way and anyone who disagreed was stupid.

A lot of the stuff that is said about Obama is just as ridiculous as the stuff that was said about JFK in 1960. Apparently he was going to turn the country over to the Vatican. He didn't. There hasn't been a Catholic in office since, but it doesn't matter, no one is worried about a Catholic being in office. I think the same is true for Obama. If he wins, the next election will not be about race or ethnicity, no matter who runs.

Valorie Delp (49340) 01 Nov 2008 05:55 AM

I have often thought of the parallels between when JFK ran and Obama running. . .

mimigrandma (445) 01 Nov 2008 06:48 AM

If you research the Bible you will see that God would not be for Obama. God is against abortion, Obama is for it. God is for marriage between a man and a woman, Obama doesn't care either way. The Bible says there will be wars and rumors of wars in the last days, which we are truly in. The Bible says the Church, people are the Church, should take care of the poor not the government. God is to be our provider not the government. People are looking to the government instead of God. That is wrong. Only God can provide more than enough, but we have to look to His Word, the Bible, to know what our responsibility is. I was a single mother of three children who are now grown. God provided all of our needs not the government and I have more than enough because I have sown the seeds necessary. That is how you get out of poverty, you work and sow, that too is in the Bible. Barack Obama has lied in this campaign, against the Word. I was raised a Democrat but as a Christian it is my responsibility to look to the Word. I am accountable for every thought, word, and deed and therefore I want to make sure I align myself with the Word of God not Obama!!!!

Kara (21185) 01 Nov 2008 07:44 AM

I thought we weren't supposed to judge people

SCG (5) 01 Nov 2008 09:22 AM

I ran across these comments recently, while not religion based, are well worth reading. They certainly make you think!

I have always heard about the democracy countdown. It is interesting to see it in print. How Long Do We Have? About the time our original thirteen states adopted their new constitution in 1787, Alexander Tyler, a Scottish history professor at the University of Edinburgh, had this to say about the fall of the Athenian Republic some 2,000 years earlier:

'A democracy is always temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist as a permanent form of government.'

'A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury.'

'From that moment on, the majority always vote for the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose fiscal policy, which is always followed by a dictatorship.'

'The average age of the world's greatest civilizations from the beginning of history, has been about 200 years' 'During those 200 years, those nations always progressed through the following sequence: 1. From bondage to spiritual faith;

2. From spiritual faith to great courage;

3. From courage to liberty; 4. From liberty to abundance; 5. From abundance to complacency; 6. From complacency to apathy; 7. From apathy to dependence;

8. From dependence back into bondage'

Professor Joseph Olson of Hemline University School of Law, St. Paul, Minnesota, points out some interesting facts concerning the 2000 Presidential election: Number of States won by: Democrats: 19 Republicans: 29 Square miles of land won by: Democrats: 580,000 Republicans: 2,427,000 Population of counties won by: Democrats: 127 million Republicans: 143 million Murder rate per 100,000 residents in counties won by: Democrats: 13.2 Republicans: 2.1 Professor Olson adds: 'In aggregate, the map of the territory Republican won was mostly the land owned by the taxpaying citizens of this great country. Democrat territory mostly encompassed those citizens living in government-owned tenements and living off various forms of government welfare...' Olson believes the United States is now somewhere between the 'complacency and apathy' phase of Professor Tyler's definition of democracy, with some forty percent of the nation's population already having reached the 'governmental dependency' phase.

Valorie Delp (49340) 01 Nov 2008 09:32 AM

Mimigrandma: But I don't think you can say God is for McCain or Palin for that matter either.

The democracy countdown is really interesting.

mcmama (51978) 01 Nov 2008 09:33 AM

I think we really limit our understanding of the eternal power of God when we assign his endorsement or disapproval to a candidate for office.

Valorie Delp (49340) 01 Nov 2008 09:58 AM

Yes--a very succint way of putting what I was trying to say.

mimigrandma (445) 01 Nov 2008 03:53 PM

I said I was going to vote for the person who aligns with the word of God. In this case John McCain aligns closer to the Word than Obama who comes no where near the Word of God. It is clear in the word the He does not approve of sin, in fact He hates it. Killing unborn babies is sin. Homosexuality is an abomination to God. You are either on God' s side or against Him, there is no middle ground. Show me in the Bible where God says it is ok to stand behind someone who is against Him and maybe then you have something to stand on. You won't find it. I'm sure come judgement day, and that is sooner than you think, we shall all find out where we stand in the sight of God. He judges by looking at your heart and if you can stand by someone who says it is ok to kill innocent babies that says whose side you are on. Do a heart check. Look to God as your source not Obama. He is not the Messiah.

mimigrandma (445) 01 Nov 2008 04:04 PM

To Kara: The Bible says we are to judge others. We are to judge them by their fruits. That way we can know what is in their heart not what they know in their head. Many who call themselves Christian do so because they know it in their head but they don't live it. They can talk the talk but not walk the walk. It is the walk that counts. Even the devil knows the Word. He can talk the talk, but know way comes near walking the walk. We have all sinned but only can be saved through a relationship with Jesus Christ. The Bible say a double minded man is unstable in all of his ways. You can't say you believe one way but your actions show the opposite. This election is surely an election planned by God. Good vs Evil. The choice is ours. Who's side are you on? God is separating the wheat from the tares. He will find out who truly is on His side.

mcmama (51978) 01 Nov 2008 04:29 PM

I'm checking back here on Wednesday to see who thinks we are heading for hell. Since I'm the ex wife of a gay man, I've been there and back, but few of my fellow Christians want to hear the story. They'd rather tell me what God wants for gay people, which really has very little to do with me and my family.

Actually, the USA is in good shape with either candidate, there are so many strengths for them both. Neither man is evil, and neither is messianic. Will be interesting to see what new directions we are challenged with - new direction will come with either one of them.

Valorie Delp (49340) 01 Nov 2008 04:32 PM

I'm sorry but McCain does not align any more closely to the Bible than does Obama. He aligns more closely to Scripture on one issue. But if we look at the whole:

McCain has been divorced and re-married. That is not allowed in the Bible except for infidelity no? Yet Obama has been married to the same woman his entire life.

McCain does not go to church, and he is not pro-life. (Well okay, he might go to church now--but he didn't before he started running.) What he does feel is that the states should decide the issue of abortion and this is why he votes consistently pro-life. He feels it is a state issue.

Have you read Audacity to Hope? In it, Obama talks about how he has helped and wants to create programs for mothers to stay at home, and for families to stay together. That's not a Christian ideal? Obama has called for black fathers to step up to the plate and be men and fathers to their children--is that not Christian?

As far as God and standing behind someone who is against him, there are numerous instances in Scripture where God allowed those who were ungodly to be in power. Saul comes to mind right away--and David in standing behind Saul was actually honoring God. What about Daniel serving as second in command (or Joseph) to ungodly kings?

Then there's the whole problem of rendering Ceasar's what is Ceasar's. . .

Looks like I just did find it. . .

mimigrandma (445) 01 Nov 2008 04:39 PM

I understand your story. My dad is gay. He left my mom when I was six years old with my sister who was five and my brother who was two. God loves gay people but He hates the sin. My sister is gay, too. We had a very abusive step-father and she later had some bad experiences with boys and she chose to be a lesbian. Homosexuality, like all sin, is a choice. She wasn't close to the Lord growing up but I was. For a long time the only love I felt I had was from Him. My faith is what kept me going. Later I had a husband who after I married him started doing drugs and was also abusive. I divorced him and raised three children alone. He has since turned his life over to the Lord and we are good friends. My brother had a tough time dealing with a father who was gay. He turned to drugs and alcohol and is in prison. He gets out this month and is coming to live with me. He has been born again and can now accept that dad chose to live the life he lived and it had nothing to do with us kids. There is hope for all of us if we keep our eyes on the Lord.

mimigrandma (445) 01 Nov 2008 04:49 PM

When Saul became King it was because Isreal wanted a king to follow instead of God. So He let them have Saul. He will let us choose who to follow also. John McCain came back from Viet Nam pretty messed up, as did my brother. I can't understand all that happened to him. He has said he was wrong for what he did to his first wife. We all make mistakes and it is our repentance that God is looking for. Obama may say things that make him sound good but his actions speak louder. The church he attended for twenty years was racist and taught hatred to white people. Not to Godly to me. When the Bible says you will know them by their fruit it is talking about actions not what they say or write in a book. Daniel and Joseph kept their eyes on the Lord. Daniel was thrown into the lions den for obeying God instead of the King. Joseph went to prison because of a lie against him but God had a plan and He has a plan for this country. The choice is ours. We must stand up for what is right. We truly are in the last of the last days when the Word says good will appear evil and evil will appear good.

mcmama (51978) 01 Nov 2008 04:51 PM

mimisgrandma, thanks for sharing. I didn't make that choice, and neither did you. Someone else in our family did. Faith brings us through it, but sometimes we can be alienated from our churches if we do not make the choices in the continuing family relationships that please the pastor (liberal or conservative) instead of the Lord. You and your brother have made an important step in realizing that your dad's choice had nothing to do with you kids. I just wish our churches were paying more attention to us, and not so much to the politics. It would be great if families could heal without having to struggle so much with this.

Neither candidate is evil. They just follow very different paths. We'll see on Wednesday what path America has chosen. Thanks again for sharing.

Valorie Delp (49340) 01 Nov 2008 05:02 PM

My point was that neither candidate is truly Christian and as Janet has pointed out, neither candidate is evil. You can go to Obama's voting record and see what he's done in inner cities caring "for the least of these." This cannot and should not be a one issue election. And personally, if we really want to talk about affecting actual change for abortion, then I think the question isn't who we elect but what we're willing to do to help women who are in horribly awful situations. While McCain has a history of voting pro-life, Obama has a history of fixing the situations that lead to abortion. I'm not sure that you can really call one Christian or another. Furthermore, I'm well aware of Biblical history--I'm just saying that our leaders are not always Godly--and it seems that God ordains it this way. And yet still, we may well be called to "stand beside" them.

Valorie Delp (49340) 01 Nov 2008 05:04 PM

And Janet, we're all going straight to hell in a hand basket. ;-) Wendesday should be interesting. ;-)

Pattie Hughes (7652) 01 Nov 2008 05:33 PM

I'm amazed. I've never had this many comments on a blog! I don't think either candidate or political party is evil. With this blog, I was merely rejecting the idea that the Republican party is necessarily the best, or only , choice for Christians. I don't think God would endorse either man, but I do think He'd have some opinions on certain issues. I think He would agree with McCain on the prolife issue, in theory, but be disappointed that nothing has been done by the Republican party. One issue voting makes no sense, particularly when they do nothing more than say they are pro life. Nothing changes, so I won't base my vote on that issue.

One of the reasons I feel Obama aligns more with my beliefs is exactly as Val states, Obama has a history of, and plans to fix situations that lead to abortion and does have a record of helping the "least" in our society, which is something I value highly and don't consider a gift or socialism, merely doing what is right and just. As can be seen in the lowered abortion rates during Clinton's years, this is an effective strategy for reducing the number of abortions, something both sides agree on. :) For the record, I actually do agree with McCain and think each state should vote on the issue.

PS NO ONE is going to Hell, at least not for this election. ;)

Kara (21185) 01 Nov 2008 05:56 PM

geez...I'm still sticking with God being the better judge. I don't know what he really thinks or wants. I know what is in the bible but not sure which parts he wants to be followed because there is alot of contradiction in the bible. So my vote goes based off what I think is best according to my beliefs and values and...I do think we should help people who need help...I believe that's what God would have me do. JMO

ruthann8 (6378) 01 Nov 2008 06:11 PM

Pattie, IMO I don't think letting the state decide on the abortion issue is the best plan. Mainly because those who need an abortion will travel to another state and that leaves those with out the money, transportation, health insurance, etc. not able to go to another state to get an abortion. It kind of makes it a class issue. I think there may be better ways of getting the abortion rate down.

Pattie Hughes (7652) 01 Nov 2008 08:13 PM

I do understand that, Ruthann. I just don't see it as a bad compromise between those who want full choice and those who want to completely outlaw it. Maybe they should do something like a clear majority, such as 2/3 of voters in a particular state. I don't really know the solution and don't pretend to, but I do see your point as well as the other side of the coin. I am very much in favor of putting our money where our collective mouth is in terms of creating a culture where women may actually see it as a "choice" and not the only way out of a bad situation. Things like health care, maternity leave, decent daycare and a stronger economy do work together to help reduce the abortion rates, as well as making life a little better for those babies once they are born, when the politicians and protestors are gone.

mimigrandma (445) 01 Nov 2008 09:49 PM

The republicans have done something about partial birth abortion. Obama says he will reverse that ban. There is never a reason for aborting a full term baby. If the mother's life is in danger all they have to do is a c-section and they both live. I to believe in taking care of the least of these, but it should be the church not the government. Abortion is not birth control. I believe as does God that life begins at conception. God told Jeremiah that he had a plan for him before he was born and that he knew him in the womb. I am not trying to judge people and you are not going to hell on Wednesday if you vote for Obama but I do believe God will judge those that do not line up with the word. Kara, the Bible does not contradict itself. If that would be so God would be a liar. Contradictions seem to be there when scripture is taken out of context. God wants to help others because we feel it is right not because the government forces us to by redistibuting the wealth. I have worked hard for what I have and the Lord has blessed me in so many ways. Only He has the right to take from me. I pay my taxes but I sure don't want them to go up to pay for someone who can work but chooses not to.

Valorie Delp (49340) 02 Nov 2008 02:54 AM

Ruthann. . .I too see your point but the problem with NOT allowing states to choose is that then we start to mess with the constitution. (Yeah--I know we already mess with it nayways.) But that is really a slippery slope downwards--that's how we get to allow judges to legislate from the bench and it really is a breakdown. Kara--you will get no where trying to tell me that the Bible contradicts itself. Nor is that a dialogue that you can have with a Christian--I'm not offended but I definitely don't belive that and I know my stuff pretty well. That's really not the kind of dialogue that we can have in this format. ;-) Gosh Pattie--I need to get off here and get some blogging done!

Mary Ann Romans (26791) 02 Nov 2008 11:46 AM

I want to share something that my son said. He overheard this at school, and I think it is awful. "What are you called if you believed jesus died for your sins?" "Answer: A Republican!" This goes back to Pattie's point that FOR SOME PEOPLE there is an attitude that if you are a Democrat you cannot be Christian. Now try explaining what this joke means to a seven-year-old. The prejudice made me sick. Did the other seven-year-old boy make this joke up on his own? Most likely he heard it from a "responsible" adult. Wherever you stand, I think a joke like this is horrible.

Pattie Hughes (7652) 02 Nov 2008 01:07 PM

That is sickening, but it really does illustrate my point. I highly doubt a 7 year old made it up on his own. Although kids do come to their own conclusions. My 10 year old told me John McCain is mean. I asked why, hoping it wasn't our discussions that made her think that and mentally preparing some responses to indicate he isn't mean, just wrong! She said, "Because when he talks on tv, he is always yelling and I can tell he hates Barack Obama." Really sad.

mcmama (51978) 02 Nov 2008 01:38 PM

MaryAnn, maybe your son overheard it from someone who doesn't practice a religion. That comment is the type of secularism that my oldest son encountered in college. Normal intelligent people aren't really religious and vote democrat or independent. Christians believe all sorts of junk and vote Republican. It was just so wounding!

Patty, that is odd that she thinks McCain is yelling, because he really isn't. But he sure looks old and frustrated. I don't think he hates Obama, probably has that feeling for a few people in his own party at this point. He could look like a mean old guy to her, contrasted to Obama's measured responses and optimistic rallies.

mimigrandma (445) 02 Nov 2008 03:51 PM

Well if we are going to resort to name calling. Most of the people I know that vote Democrat are lazy, ignorant and have their hand out wanting something for nothing. The people I know that vote republican are extremely intelligent, high moral values, hard working and usually Cristian which is why the have high moral values. Democrats don't even try to look into the issues and get the facts, they just believe whatever their candidate says, even lies, and don't bother to see if it's true, which coes back to the lazy part. They are not interested in the truth.

Pattie Hughes (7652) 02 Nov 2008 07:37 PM

I can see the Christian values shining forth in the previous comment. Thanks for proving my point!

mcmama (51978) 02 Nov 2008 07:59 PM

My kids are Christians, albeit more liberal than I am. They voted like me - Obama, and then the straight republican ticket. The one who is still voting in NJ was not wild about the local republicans, but was voting out the crooks.

Melissa J (13710) 02 Nov 2008 08:32 PM

Pattie, I haven't gotten the impression of Republicans that you have. But it might be we live in different parts of the US(?) I respect your blog is based on your personal perception of things and that's fine. Jesus didn't speak on a lot of issues that were covered in the old testiment. It didn't mean He didn't abide by them! To discredit what the Book of Romans says on the issue of homosexuality (as one example) is to discredit the validity of the New Testiment. That of course is a whole other debate that has gone in circles on the forums in the past.

Kudos on getting our attention though and getting us thinking and talking. This is a critically important election and as Christians we should pray regardless of who may be elected. For Republicans, wouldn't it be awesome if Obama did realize the sanctity of unborn life and change? It's possible just as God changed the heart of Pharoh, he can change the hearts of current candidates as well. Same goes to Christian Democrats; wouldn't it be great to see God touch the heart of McCain to see the importance in issues on your side too. Obviously God's ways are perfect and HE knows what is ultimately best for our nation, knowing the future.

A couple years ago I blogged here at Families and wrote a blog on "What to do with post election frustrations". You can cut and paste this link: http://christian.families.com/blog/what-to-do-with-post-election-frustrations Perhaps if your guy doesn't get picked, you'll find some hope and peace in my old blog.

mcmama (51978) 02 Nov 2008 08:44 PM

MJ good to see you!

Pam Connell (2658) 03 Nov 2008 05:55 PM

The evening after I first read this blog, I was reading some newspaper endorsements of local and state candidates. The authors they made about 3 or 4 comments like, "X does not state his position on Issue A, but he is (Catholic, Evangelical) and therefore can be expected to do Y."

I thought, what a great illustration of what Pattie was saying in this blog!

Pattie I do think you came across as pretty harsh near the end of the blog--most Republican Christians I know aren't hypocrites--but I am so glad you wrote this blog because it's a frustration I've had for a while that people assume that because I am a member of one group (church, political party) I must then be a member of another.

Recently a woman I've known for five years told me that until now she had always assumed I was a Republican. (In my state we don't register by party. That's fortunate, because I have Democratic leanings but strong pro-life views, which leaves me pretty much politically homeless. I have actually read the state platforms of the Republican and Democratic parties in my state and would not be comfortable putting my name to either of them.)

The point is, someone who I thought knew me fairly well was way off-base about some of my basic beliefs and principles--she made assumptions because she knew what church I attended. This is really pretty common and rather painful.

Pattie Hughes (7652) 03 Nov 2008 07:46 PM

Pam, I think you misunderstood. I wasn't calling Republican Christians hypocrites, but politicians who use Jesus as a bumper sticker slogan to get votes and then make decisions in office which seem in direct contrast to the teachings of Jesus, whom they used to get into office. (war, huge handouts to wealthy corporations, cutting social programs for poor/working poor) That is hypocrisy, but the voters aren't responsible for that! If they are going to run on a platform of being a follower of Christ, they should act like it when they attain the office they seek.

Valorie Delp (49340) 07 Nov 2008 11:53 AM

Hey I just found out Billy Graham is a Democrat!

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